Electric??

[Jon A]

No, it’s not from the Daily Mail!

Just looked this up in USA today and it seems this was a Facebook post that was not true. It was a heatwave and no mention was made of electric vehicles…

[GWL]

2. Those that have no intention to buy electric yet as they believe its too early to jump into a technology that is still comparatively unproven in the long term or want to see how alternative technologies (Hydrogen etc.) progress.

I'm in the above category. For a start, I certainly don't think the current UK Govt. has (or is capable of having) a thought-through strategy for electric vehicles. Taking just my street of 110 houses as an example, we are supplied by a cable which was laid some 45 years ago and usually fails every 18 months due to its deteriorating condition. It's more repair joints than cable. As far as I can see, there are only 4 or 5 people in the street who have electric vehicles. I don't think the cable will be up to supporting many more chargers and would have to be replaced to do so. ...and this is just one street.

There will have to be massive infrastructure investment by the Electricity Supply industry to enable mass adoption of electric vehicles. How, when energy costs are already soaring, is this to be paid for - and how is it to be achieved?

To me it seems crazy to abandon the system & logistics of fuelling hubs (Petrol stations) and instead have to upgrade most to the country's local electricity infrastructure. I think we have to retain the high pass-through hub approach that petrol stations give us and that this, at present, can only be achieved by use of Hydrogen fuelled vehicles.

[Miopyk]

9. Those that have bought electric and believe they are so unequivocally right about that decision that they dismiss alternative views (i.e. all the above) as misinformation from dinosaurs living in the past clinging to a dead technology.

There's a difference between making an informed vs a misinformed decision about EVs. There are examples of both in this thread. There are those who actually understand the pros and cons of EVs and decided to stick with ICE and there are those who clearly don't understand and in some cases don't even want to understand.

In hindsight I made the right decision for myself (4 years in, 2 EVs, no regrets, no plans to ever go back), but I'm NOT telling anyone else they should drive an EV because people have different needs and there are plenty of cases where an EV wouldn't work too well for them. I'm doing nothing more than pointing out some of the misconceptions about EVs being touted by people who don't have any experience and very shallow knowledge of the subject. You can take it or leave it. Usually people just read what they want to read anyway, which I've learnt is not actually very smart.

The most remarkable thing about this post is that you've chosen to put yourself in category 9 when you could quite easily have chosen category 6

[Wing Commander]

No, it’s not from the Daily Mail!

Just looked this up in USA today and it seems this was a Facebook post that was not true. It was a heatwave and no mention was made of electric vehicles…

Fake news!? Surely not!?

[Deleted User 1874]

9. Those that have bought electric and believe they are so unequivocally right about that decision that they dismiss alternative views (i.e. all the above) as misinformation from dinosaurs living in the past clinging to a dead technology.

There's a difference between making an informed vs a misinformed decision about EVs. There are examples of both in this thread. There are those who actually understand the pros and cons of EVs and decided to stick with ICE and there are those who clearly don't understand and in some cases don't even want to understand.

In hindsight I made the right decision for myself (4 years in, 2 EVs, no regrets, no plans to ever go back), but I'm NOT telling anyone else they should drive an EV because people have different needs and there are plenty of cases where an EV wouldn't work too well for them. I'm doing nothing more than pointing out some of the misconceptions about EVs being touted by people who don't have any experience and very shallow knowledge of the subject. You can take it or leave it. Usually people just read what they want to read anyway, which I've learnt is not actually very smart.

The most remarkable thing about this post is that you've chosen to put yourself in category 9 when you could quite easily have chosen category 6

No you chose to put me in category 9

[Deleted User 1874]

2. Those that have no intention to buy electric yet as they believe its too early to jump into a technology that is still comparatively unproven in the long term or want to see how alternative technologies (Hydrogen etc.) progress.

I'm in the above category. For a start, I certainly don't think the current UK Govt. has (or is capable of having) a thought-through strategy for electric vehicles. Taking just my street of 110 houses as an example, we are supplied by a cable which was laid some 45 years ago and usually fails every 18 months due to its deteriorating condition. It's more repair joints than cable. As far as I can see, there are only 4 or 5 people in the street who have electric vehicles. I don't think the cable will be up to supporting many more chargers and would have to be replaced to do so. ...and this is just one street.

There will have to be massive infrastructure investment by the Electricity Supply industry to enable mass adoption of electric vehicles. How, when energy costs are already soaring, is this to be paid for - and how is it to be achieved?

To me it seems crazy to abandon the system & logistics of fuelling hubs (Petrol stations) and instead have to upgrade most to the country's local electricity infrastructure. I think we have to retain the high pass-through hub approach that petrol stations give us and that this, at present, can only be achieved by use of Hydrogen fuelled vehicles.

Virtually all electric car charging is done overnight when grid demand is currently very low. In future, grid demand will be more evenly distributed around the clock. Overall grid demand has also been falling over the last decade as we become more energy efficient and there is still a long way to go in that respect, both in domestic and commercial usage. I'm sure there will need to be some infrastructure investment, but that is inevitable.

https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/jo ... ctric-cars

Meanwhile, establishing a fully functioning national hydrogen fuelling network is proving to be a major problem. It's a huge chicken and egg scenario. We have already seen how reluctant people are to move to EVs because of the immature public charging network. Nobody is going to buy a hydrogen powered car until they are confident they can refuel it right across the country. It doesn't have the kick-start advantage of electricity, which is already available everywhere, including your own home. It just needs the charging infrastructure to get its act together, which it will eventually. Tesla have already demonstrated how charging is done properly.

If a national hydrogen network did miraculously appear overnight, what would be interesting is to see how many people would actually choose it over EV or petrol/diesel. Here is VWs view of EV vs Hydrogen. The main issues with hydrogen are high cost, low efficiency and infrastructure.

https://www.volkswagenag.com/en/news/st ... stion.html#

[MikeM]

Let’s get some balance here. This is Toyotas position and already with 156 stations in place.

https://www.just-auto.com/features/toyo ... eutrality/

[Jon A]

Let’s get some balance here. This is Toyotas position and already with 156 stations in place.

https://www.just-auto.com/features/toyo ... eutrality/

This is interesting but i wonder if the last sentence is the most telling? I dont know enough about this but i understood that the energy required to split the H2O molecule was cost prohibitive?

Also, there is some chatter re synthetic fuels - what are these and do they have a future?

[Deleted User 1874]

Let’s get some balance here. This is Toyotas position and already with 156 stations in place.

https://www.just-auto.com/features/toyo ... eutrality/

What's missing here is their reasoning for pursuing hydrogen vs EV. Toyota were late into EVs and now playing catch up. It just looks like they backed the wrong horse initially, at least in the respect of personal transport.

[Deleted User 1874]

Also, there is some chatter re synthetic fuels - what are these and do they have a future?

I would imagine the future here lies in medium term running of existing ICE vehicles and use in the third world and remote places with limited electricity infrastructure. There will never be or need to be a single power source for all cars. It's just a matter of relative scale.